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Dream Card Essense Of The Tigers

Dream Card "Essense Of The Tigers"
by prosaic  for YuGiOh!
Essense Of The Tigers card image: click to enlarge
Essense Of The Tigers
Choose 1 or both of these effects:
*Equip this card to a monster with 'Tiger' in its name. That monster gain 700 Atk points.
*Discard one card with Tiger in its name and draw two cards.
If this face-up card is destroyed, by discarding one Tiger monster,you can special summon another Tiger monster from your graveyard.

Not in the least broken. Increasing attack by 700 is just like rush recklessly.
As for drawing 2 cards, you'll have to wait a turn.
For the special sumon effect, this csard MUST be destroyed, not sent to the graveyard, and in addition you have e to discard another tiger, and the only tiger seeing play is Test Tiger!!!


  • Rarity: Ultimate Rare
  • Card Type: Trap Card
  • Password: 98334616
 
[Modified on August 23, 2008 09:31 pm]
 

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fallcloud
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Subject: very nice   Posted: August 23, 2008 02:25 pm

Really good card pro, not anything i would have thought of. Its original i must say.
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evanferko Premium Member
LV14 Greece

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July 18, 2008
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Subject:    Posted: August 26, 2008 02:15 pm

very good and original but dont suppose tigers will be smth playable...
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shinobi_phoenix
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Subject:    Posted: August 26, 2008 03:36 pm

Just because the only Tiger you personally think is in play is Test/Slave Tiger doesn't mean you should slap an effect on something without a counterbalance.

And you're still be wrong because there's still several Tigers in this game that see use, not to mention this is still a CAC, so someone including yourself can just make a bunch of new Tigers.

Also you misspelled "essence"


Since no one else will do it, someone has to give some actual critique:

You're essentially getting 3 good effects for nothing and a player can always take advantage of how a card works. Discard is nothing, or did you forgot that Graceful Charity is banned for a reason?

On top of that, you purposely made the last effect to work with the second, so you discard and destroy this card to Summon the Tiger you discarded right back. So what was the point to even putting a price on it? In fact, the last effect itself can just Special Summon back the very Tiger you discarded for that too. Basically the card itself renders its own costs of it moot and pointless.

Let me explain it a little better:

You said: "As for drawing 2 cards, you'll have to wait a turn."
-- No you don't, you don't have to wait. You said nothing that would imply or make someone do that. I could understand if you said "During your Main Phase, Discard one card with Tiger in its name and draw two cards." That would be waiting a turn. However, with your card as it is, a person will just set it and end their turn and activate it immediately during your Draw Phase. There's also card that would speed up the process like cards similar to Jetroid or Cathedral of Nobles.

You said: "For the special sumon effect, this csard MUST be destroyed, not sent to the graveyard..."
-- You make it sound like that makes it harder? It makes it easier. First off, this makes it works even when a "Banisher type" card (like Macro Cosmos) is around. Second, the basic thing someone would do is use a card to destroy their own card to trigger it.

I set Essence and Mystical Space Typhoon, then end my Turn. I activate Essence on your turn, discard a Tiger for the cost, I chain MST to it to destroy my own card (which you can do), which triggers the 3rd effect after the chain has resolved and I can pull back my Tiger after I discard again. I'm just glad you put "you can" there because maybe that way it would miss the timing, but I doubt that you put "you can" there because you knew that. My point is a lot of what you thought about the card isn't really true and it needs some balancing re-writes.

No sense of balance or mechanic. 2 free cards and a Special Summoned Tiger and I didn't lose much. Do you see what I mean? You can't just slap costs on a card and expect it automatically justifies what you want to put on it.
Back to top Modified on August 26, 2008 04:00 pm 
prosaic
Mauritius

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Subject:    Posted: August 27, 2008 08:04 am


quote from shinobi_phoenix:
And you're still be wrong because there's still several Tigers in this game that see use, not to mention this is still a CAC, so someone including yourself can just make a bunch of new Tigers.


I dont see anything wroong with someone else making other tigers, but the point is Upperdeck/Konami did not.


quote from shinobi_phoenix:
Discard is nothing, or did you forgot that Graceful Charity is banned for a reason?


2.Graceful Charity was banned because it mills through 3 cards, and my dream card does not. And it's a trap card, so please do not compare opposide poles.


quote from shinobi_phoenix:
On top of that, you purposely made the last effect to work with the second, so you discard and destroy this card to Summon the Tiger you discarded right back. So what was the point to even putting a price on it? In fact, the last effect itself can just Special Summon back the very Tiger you discarded for that too. Basically the card itself renders its own costs of it moot and pointless.


I am sorry to say you understood absolutely nothing. Look at the effect carefully. I said "by discarding one Tiger monster,you can special summon another Tiger monster from your graveyard." YOU CANNOT SPECIAL THE TIGER YOU DISCARDED, I SAID ANOTHER
And you clearly dont know the game mechanics too well also, which is shown by your freaky description of how you can use the draw effect and s.summon effect.


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

Let me explain it a little better:


Spare me please...


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

You said: "As for drawing 2 cards, you'll have to wait a turn."
-- No you don't, you don't have to wait. You said nothing that would imply or make someone do that.


It is a trap card. If you cant use it in your turn like Allure Of Darkness, you wouldn't benefit IMMEDIATELY after drawing it.


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

You said: "For the special sumon effect, this csard MUST be destroyed, not sent to the graveyard..."
-- You make it sound like that makes it harder? It makes it easier. First off, this makes it works even when a "Banisher type" card (like Macro Cosmos) is around. Second, the basic thing someone would do is use a card to destroy their own card to trigger it.


I again disagree with you on this one. Sent to the graveyardd would just make things easier. Oh and in the card effect, said this face up card ...


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

I'm just glad you put "you can" there because maybe that way it would miss the timing, but I doubt that you put "you can" there because you knew that.


That's a good joke worth laughing at.


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

My point is a lot of what you thought about the card isn't really true and it needs some balancing re-writes.


I am glad to learn of your opinions about my card.

quote from shinobi_phoenix:

No sense of balance or mechanic. 2 free cards and a Special Summoned Tiger and I didn't lose much. Do you see what I mean?


The only thing I see is that you misread the effect and got angry because you didnt see it as it was. You cannot discard and special sumon the same tiger.
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shinobi_phoenix
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Subject:    Posted: August 27, 2008 02:26 pm

You seem to think I called your card broken or something. It's not, at least not in the sense of being overpowered. It's still mechanically broken, not "broken" as in the slang term people coined to mean "overpowered" because a card "makes and breaks" a game for someone too easily. Your card isn't broken because it doesn't do much of anything except copy Kunai with Chain and its text and another Destiny Draw clone from you (again), but your comments on it make it clear you don't understand how people will use it. That's what I'm touching on.


quote from prosaic:


quote from shinobi_phoenix:
And you're still be wrong because there's still several Tigers in this game that see use, not to mention this is still a CAC, so someone including yourself can just make a bunch of new Tigers.


I dont see anything wroong with someone else making other tigers, but the point is Upperdeck/Konami did not.


You said Slave Tiger (TCG: Test Tiger, ) was the only Tiger that sees use. Not only wrong unless you're only looking at tournaments since they are mostly all using Gladiator Beast, but you changed your argument now. Either way, there's more than necessary that you're ignoring, but the fact remains tigers aren't a archetype to be built on, it's just a name. That's like complaining there aren't enough bears and dolphins. One should be so lucky they made as many tigers as they have by now. There's still plenty that exist and see use when you care to look. V-Tiger Jet for XYZ users can use your card. Amazoness Tiger, Topaz Tiger, Tiger Dragon from CSOC, and the most used combo builder Tiger is still King Tiger Wanghu (Slave Tiger is used only because of Gladiator Beast). Wanghu has crazy recurrence combos (they already KSS'ed the combo with Black Garden in Japan to kill that very much broken combo with Wanghu) and "shrinking" combos using cards that reduce stats as a continuous effect, such as Burden of the Mighty (which is mean). It kills all "weenies" instantly including Tree-bored Frog, and it was also be abused with Disc Guy and Undead World. There's 11 Tigers that can be used with your card and that's not even including every card that has Tiger is their names. It's still not Konami's fault for not building on a archetype that doesn't exist, doesn't mean you shouldn't take responsibility for being fair and proper with your design.


quote from prosaic:


quote from shinobi_phoenix:
Discard is nothing, or did you forgot that Graceful Charity is banned for a reason?


2.Graceful Charity was banned because it mills through 3 cards, and my dream card does not. And it's a trap card, so please do not compare opposide poles.


No it wasn't. Every draw card inherently mills. Even Destiny Hero Defend Guy and Chainsaw Insect are milling cards and used as such in mill decks. Milling still just means digging it. It was banned for the same reason as all other Draw Engines that give you more than 1 card per turn without much trouble. Overuse and versatility same as a lot of cards (also see: Tsukiyomi, Sinister Serpent, Makyura and Disc Guy). You can take advantage of the discard in many ways, which is why Graceful is seen as so much better than Pot of Greed. You get 3 and use the discard to build your strategy using recurrance, resurrection or RFG. Zombies and Dark World LOVE Graceful Charity, that's why they made a reduced version for Dark World to use that helps your opponent too.


quote from prosaic:


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

You said: "As for drawing 2 cards, you'll have to wait a turn."
-- No you don't, you don't have to wait. You said nothing that would imply or make someone do that.


It is a trap card. If you cant use it in your turn like Allure Of Darkness, you wouldn't benefit IMMEDIATELY after drawing it.

And Traps mean nothing with a lot of cards.

So according to you, a draw engine isn't good unless you can get your cards and use them immediately, even though you can't even always use the cards immediately depending on what you drew anyway. Not to mention still wrong as they're still plenty of decks that can and will use cards from hand during their opponent's turn. Not only cards with effects that activate out of turn (like Kuriboh, the Herald cards like Herald of Orange Light, and Hana Watapon/Hanawata), there's also cards that just care for you to have cards in hand to use for other reasons, just as Dark World, or cards with discard cost like Heraklinos or Dark Paladin. Reckless Greed and Good Goblin Housekeeping were both restricted for a time until they were shown not to be as bad or at least not as capable of abuse and they were dropped from restriction. Hell, Allure of Darkness isn't even limited (check the ban list, Konami cancelled UDE's restriction on it when they agreed to ban Dimension Fusion). Still it's your problem for not playing or understanding how to play to full potential fairly. The rest of us are still using Jar of Greed, Corpse of Yatagarasu or Call of the Haunted-on-Disc Guy or Sacred Crane during their opponent's turns (until September 1st anyway). That is only counter to your underestimation of Traps, not your card. Think what you want, but the real cards out there say otherwise.



quote from prosaic:


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

You said: "For the special sumon effect, this csard MUST be destroyed, not sent to the graveyard..."
-- You make it sound like that makes it harder? It makes it easier. First off, this makes it works even when a "Banisher type" card (like Macro Cosmos) is around. Second, the basic thing someone would do is use a card to destroy their own card to trigger it.


I again disagree with you on this one. Sent to the graveyardd would just make things easier. Oh and in the card effect, said this face up card ...


You do know that activated cards (all of them) are face-up on the field and remain on the field until they resolve, right? Including Normal Magic, Rituals, and Normal Traps. That's why one of the most common tactics is to Chain Emergency Provisions to a Normal Magic cards, especially ones that have Life Point cost. It sends them to the Graveyard and you still get their effects as well as you gaining 1000+. Similarly, you can chain Magical Arrow to your opponent's Magic, regardless of what kind it is, even Normal, and destroy it to inflict 500 damage to your opponent. It won't negate the card unless it's static (like Revealing Swords) or Continuous, but it will deal the damage.

With your card, I can activate it and let it resolve for the first effect, then use Mystical Space Typhoon on it to Special Summon. The only reason it won't work in chain is because your "you can" wording. Normally that would get a Missed the Timing unless they KSS it. It could work, or it couldn't (Missed Timing), but since your card will never be ruled on, it's a moot point.

Also, I hope you understand the differences between the various removal phrases.

"Destroyed, and sent to the Graveyard" on your card would make someone can destroy it but if Macro Cosmos is active, you can't use the effect.

"Destroyed" alone, like your card says makes it that all it has to be is a "destroy" effect and it'll work. Regardless of where it ends up after it's destroyed. RFG with Macro Cosmos or recycling cards like Grave Protector (or the ones that work for all cards in OCG). Neither will stop it.

"Send to the Graveyard" would be like Emergency Provisions or Dark End Dragon. If you had put that, this card would be so much harder to activate unless you worded it right.

"Sent to the Graveyard" would be most everything as long as it goes to the Graveyard, but again, Macro Cosmos / Banishers would negate the effects of it.

"Destroyed" alone has fewer weaknesses than "Destroyed and sent to the Graveyard" while "sent to the Graveyard" alone is just has more cards you can do it with but bigger weaknesses. I just think you should use "destroyed and sent to the Graveyard" so there can be some balance in it.



quote from prosaic:


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

I'm just glad you put "you can" there because maybe that way it would miss the timing, but I doubt that you put "you can" there because you knew that.


That's a good joke worth laughing at.

You know what missed the timing is right? That would be the only balance I saw. Your opponent could destroy your card in chain (including with a negation effect) and you wouldn't get your Special Summon because it would miss its timing of the activation condition (because the last thing that happened would be drawing cards or gaining 700 ATK). Only if the card was already active using the first effect (not just activated and chained against) would be how you would get to Special Summon, because you used "you can Special Summon" in the text, instead of just "Special Summon" That's optional vs mandatory. I saw that as intentional balance, because I don't think you meant to put "you can" on your card for that reason. (Also see: Pinch Hopper). Yes, with that attitude you're giving, it is funny.


quote from prosaic:


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

My point is a lot of what you thought about the card isn't really true and it needs some balancing re-writes.


I am glad to learn of your opinions about my card.

quote from shinobi_phoenix:

No sense of balance or mechanic. 2 free cards and a Special Summoned Tiger and I didn't lose much. Do you see what I mean?


The only thing I see is that you misread the effect and got angry because you didnt see it as it was. You cannot discard and special sumon the same tiger.


The only anger I see if coming from you. Your reaction makes it all too obvious. I could care less. Some people can learn easily and others pretend they want to (even on my forum) and I don't care for someone who can't take advice they don't want to see anyone's way but their own. Other people like my advice just fine since I study rulings and help them against bad judges (Example: a judge who won't let you call "Psychic" when using DNA Surgery, even though you're using Psychics and it's a established Sub-Type to call; Judges are morons), and that helps my card creations and my friends. I was advising to improve it so it would work the way you think it does now. If you choose to be a certain way, that's your decision and it's your card. Peace and love.
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shinobi_phoenix
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Subject:    Posted: August 27, 2008 02:27 pm

Forget it, I don't care enough anyway.
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prosaic
Mauritius

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Subject:    Posted: August 28, 2008 04:56 am


quote from shinobi_phoenix:

Forget it, I don't care enough anyway.

Me too, but thanks for al the trouble you took so far!!

quote from shinobi_phoenix:

(even on my forum)


?
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