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deified_cupcake · **Subject:** **Posted:** January 25, 2013 02:12 am

Nice job with the article. Extremely informative but wow that's a lot of pictures. Really sad you had to retype this all

. The only minor issue I have with your review is you go into extensive detail about light cards and blockers with heaven's gate but I am not really sure that was necessary. Even though it is informative and there's a lot to discuss, perhaps trying to keep it simple and concise for the reader might be the best approach. If you have a clear outline of how you want to explain this card and let the reader know exactly why you are bringing up the cards you do will help the reader understand what is going on in your article better. For example, if I was talking about a card like, say, the Allshot Magnum creature, I would divide my review into different overlapping categories. First I would describe all the necessary stuff such as card art, rulings, and so forth. Then I would move on to its strengths in weaknesses. After this, in the third category, I would describe its implementation. In this category I would have many sub categories, and this would probably be the biggest section of the review. In it I would describe the history of the cards implementation, popular reception in the meta, and so forth. Then I would describe which kinds of decks could use it and what other cards with similar effects can also be used/used instead (this last part can be included in strengths and weaknesses too). Anyway, basically all I am saying is streamlining the material in a methodical manner is the best way to explain a card.

waileukwu · **Subject:** **Posted:** January 28, 2013 07:19 am

Someone revoked my vote of 1, how can that be? Is it not good enough of a motivation? Hm oh well, guess I have to make a more valid judgement next time.

So here begins my review, well, a review of a review anyway :3

First rule of thumb: Yellow is a taboo in card reviews unless you are trying to make some word art out of it, or the white background utterly mask all the words you wrote in yellow.

Second rule of thumb: align the pictures. You have a staggering 97 pictures (could be wrong), but most of them are gigantic. You nearly took the biggest pictures for them all and used it in the review, which right now...wouldn't be the best idea as the pictures will actually make the reader scroll down far more often then they would.

But yes, 97 pictures, it is the largest amount we have seen in a review I believe, more Jun's/mine by like 30-40.

97 pictures, which meant you talked about 97 cards this can combo with? Well, more or less, yes, but a lot of them really is not necessary. Everyone knows Mana Accleration. Silver Axe (thank god that you removed it) was one of such case that made no direct relevancy.

Take for example, here is a good example of what you should've done:
'There are many more cards in the Nature Civilization which can help you to get more mana like Timeless Garden, Dreaming Moon Knife, Ascendant Wing - Faerie Accelerator, Poisonous Mushroom etc. etc. So basically the plan is, Mana Romp and summon Wedding. Simple but most often effective.'

Just list them. It is not your crime when you don't know what Faerie Life/Living Lithograph is. (and what the heck is Mana Romp?

)

What we want to learn from a card review is that we want to know what kinda decks we can make out of it, and you done your job well, seperating them into the groups of combos rather than the individual combos they can make. Pretty, I know, and Zenith X Barrage, Zenith X Marshall Memory, Zenith X cost reduction, Zenith X Mana Acceleration are all but good ways of playing a Zenith.

However there are some major flaws.
Now, we come to the part of specification. What you had was a great guide...to pretty any Zenith cards. I can play Radio Rose or Greatest Great with this, no? Suspense surely will work with all those cards. It is necessary to explain to us how all of them can work for Wedding, but also give us how Wedding should be relevant to a Deck. Just looking at the combo sections, the ones that actually talks about Wedding (or is Weddding specific) are probably the Pepper Silva combo, Last Avatar Combo, and...well...that's it.

But wait, you did talk about symphony, right? Wedding is great with Symphony...no?

I have some problems about the way talked about the beautiful combo of zenith symphony. No, it is not wrong to combo ragon with symphony with wedding-it is very wrong to do so. Ragon gives no speed attacker to Wedding, where her strongest effect is to burn shields while Wedding gives 4 extra Shields, and at 7 mana your opponent usually have more than 4 cards to spare for their Shields. Unless it is situation where your opponent had nothing else other than 4 cards to remove, Baza basically gives ur op 4 Shields and you have to wait till Wedding is out to burn them, or else any other form of attack will just send those cards back to your op's Hand.

A better way to tell that combo would be to have Mess > Ragon > attack > Symphony > Wedding > 3 Shields burned, or else Radio Rose is always a better card in this case (or Greatest Great).

And then...Lionel leodol build leone>.> Really? Of all the good Unknowns, you mention them (other than Build Leone, which is very powerful creature by attacking)? What is wrong is that most decks with HG is draw intensive, where even symphony X Radio Rose makes it better than Wedding unless again u need some removal...but again, they break 2 shields each...

And then...y would you talk about Symphony without talking about ultra saver? It is always better to keep Wedding in BZ than Hand, unlike some other Zeniths can is okay to respam.

Onto the pile of stuff where you talked about the banned cards...really, you don't have to mention them, for if you play without the banlist, Wedding should not really be anywhere near those cards you would play it with. Sapphire Dragon pretty much outclasses her.

And then, you talk about Weaknesses/Cons where you said:
'None really. High cost is expected with the effect that Wedding has. It can easily gain speed attacker with the support cards. It can be protected against discard using Berlin, Bell Gravekeeper. It can be reshuffled back to deck if put to grave by slash trio using Forever Princess, An Eternity to Rule Them. So no Apparent Weaknesses.'

and at that, I was speechless...what? Wedding has no weakness? Of course she seems so perfect, 11 cost 13000 power with Eternal Omega and ability to remove creatures into Shields and then remove the Shields through attack. Perfect, isn't it?

No it is not. What you gain by using her is that you will sacrifice your deck composition just so you can use properly. Discard her, and your opponent will cry. Even if you op got it into the BZ, all you need to do is to freeze/stop it from attacking, and she will be one of those giant beatsticks that does nothing. Remember a creature named Nariel? Wedding hates that. Absolutely hates it. Oh, and there is VPP, of which Wedding hates too. Oh and all those blockers that can nullify attacks...It is a solo creature, very much like Ken Geki and Victory Rush. 1 creature to win you the game, and also 1 creature to loose it for you.

Again, if you want some specific stuff that can punish the user of Wedding, how about these:
1) What, you hate the fact Wedding forces you to put shields? Ghastly drain yourself. you have plenty of cards in hand.
2) What, you can't help the fact that Wedding keep bashing through everything by requiem? Saint Castle + Slaying Ninja can keep her at bay, then discard it immediately the next turn.
3) What, you don't like the fact that a big creature come into play? use this creature:
http://www.tradecardsonline.com/im/selectCard/card_id/173934/cards_lang/1

Lastly, the biggest value of Wedding is not by summoning. No, it is by the way she breaks shield that we love her. If you can get wedding out through Miramisu by t4 or t5, yo have bought yourself a creature that can rip through Shields, and all we need to know is that big creatures that burn Shields are utterly amazing. This is also the weakest part of your review. You focused so much about summoning it...but it should be how to get her to break shields that matters. It is the sole reason why she is such a boss. So I did rather see stuff like Doskoi to make her unblockable, stuff that untaps her like timer, or to untap her than a section on how to 'Mana Romp'.

Well that was harsh wasn't it? Actually consider those praises, for they are not great flaws, but just problems I had with points that you made very clear, which is how to get her out. After all, Wedding only makes an impact when she is in the Battle Zone, and no where else.

And buddy 97 pictures! You have rewrite those parts!? How on earth did you do it? Good job, *pat you on the back*.

And sorry, I wrote it in white so that you have to highlight to see it. Wait, what are reviews for again? For us to highlight or for us to read?

shuriken6 · **Subject:** **Posted:** January 28, 2013 06:30 pm

^ Biggest... Troll Comment... Ever!

waileukwu · **Subject:** **Posted:** January 29, 2013 02:44 am

^ I assume you highlighted it to read it? :3

I actually wrote something there u know

shuriken6 · **Subject:** **Posted:** January 29, 2013 06:16 pm

quote from waileukwu:

^ I assume you highlighted it to read it? :3

I actually wrote something there u know

lol i know u wrote something. but the fact that it's completely white still is trolling nonetheless

nerafim · **Subject:** **Posted:** February 1, 2013 11:33 am

As much as I'd like to go into my own appreciation of the card, I believe I promised rating, talking and suggestions on the article...Since the card itself is already superb and incredibly powerful in an obvious way what an article should do is just let people (noobs moreso) know how not to fail with it and then you could add a lot of awesome trivia and fantasy, scenarios, cool ideas about it and "rep building".

As much as I liked some of the absurd combos and basic information, and especially the nice literal piece on the art, the problem with the article (aside the HUGE amount of card arts) is that there is TOO MUCH fluff, trivia and fancy talk on the card. There is no real separation between what one needs to know and random card delighting.

Since the card already does so much by itself the absolutely best and easiest way to use (even to total noobs) is just flat out mana acceleration. Accel is the most free, unrestrictive, cost efficient and strategically sound way to use Wedding since it also helps everything else you can add in the deck with it. And its not just for the "on summoning" effect but especially for the Eternal Omega...Once that is set in you basically have a game winning lockdown, your opponents hands are virtually tied, because you can keep removing hand/field with it and your opponents fighting abilities are rendered useless.

Cost reduction methods added with it are ok-ish, not needed and not that great because removal in this game is so absurd the creatures shouldn't survive a single turn but they are an ok tie-in/adaptation move to a deck because they give you some presence on the field while also setting up for Wedding, so you are not being steamrolled by the opponent. They CAN NOT be used by themselves, you need to use them with acceleration to complement it or they are worthless.

Playing it indirectly is not really worth it, not just because of the effect loss normally, but also because it usually involves using a lot more cards and resources setting up for a single moment, and that means the opponent has opportunities to stop the combo from happening much easier. And on top of that simple removal really becomes great against it because you can't really do the same combo two turns in a row very plausibly, so even it's Eternal Omega becomes useless. This makes it no different and even WORSE than any other "huge creature you have to wait to attack to benefit from" or Zeniths used with the same "put in battle" effects (for example with Babelginus, you'd often be better off playing something else and Wedding would only be used on the 3rd or 4th Babelginus playing, after you managed to NOT LOSE).

The only method you mentioned really worth it is Marshall Queen with ST giving, that one is VERY strong simply because of scale and ease of use. I didn't even think that ST counts as summoning, I am pleasantly surprised and will enjoy using this technicality to my own advantage in the future. Even without the Summoning effect I considered Wedding worth playing with Queen, its just that good.

Indirect playing only has value if its a simple combo and you don't need to dedicate much deck to it, like say Savage Earth. Even Zenith Symphony barely makes the limit.

That's the basics of it, and a lot of the other stuff you mentioned is either wrong or not needed, they are cute ideas and combos, but its a confusing way to look at what makes the card powerful. I'd go into more detail on that but tl;dr so far already.

And finally...waileukwu, dude, I completely disagree with almost every criticism you gave on the card in that comment. ;/...I'd go into that too now but tl;dr again.

waileukwu · **Subject:** **Posted:** February 1, 2013 12:25 pm

^ it is good to disagree, or else there is nothing to talk about.

nerafim · **Subject:** **Posted:** February 9, 2013 04:06 am

quote from waileukwu:

I have some problems about the way talked about the beautiful combo of zenith symphony. No, it is not wrong to combo ragon with symphony with wedding-it is very wrong to do so. Ragon gives no speed attacker to Wedding, where her strongest effect is to burn shields while Wedding gives 4 extra Shields, and at 7 mana your opponent usually have more than 4 cards to spare for their Shields. Unless it is situation where your opponent had nothing else other than 4 cards to remove, Baza basically gives ur op 4 Shields and you have to wait till Wedding is out to burn them, or else any other form of attack will just send those cards back to your op's Hand.

And then...y would you talk about Symphony without talking about ultra saver? It is always better to keep Wedding in BZ than Hand, unlike some other Zeniths can is okay to respam.

Lastly, the biggest value of Wedding is not by summoning. No, it is by the way she breaks shield that we love her. If you can get wedding out through Miramisu by t4 or t5, yo have bought yourself a creature that can rip through Shields, and all we need to know is that big creatures that burn Shields are utterly amazing. This is also the weakest part of your review. You focused so much about summoning it...but it should be how to get her to break shields that matters. It is the sole reason why she is such a boss. So I did rather see stuff like Doskoi to make her unblockable, stuff that untaps her like timer, or to untap her than a section on how to 'Mana Romp'.

No, that's just wrong. The advantage of Wedding isn't the shield burn or any one effect, it's ALL of them at once.

To the untrained eye sending cards to shields might be a bad deal, but that's actually the strongest form of removal in the game because it locks them down and its hard to regain them.

Wedding has an effect that hits both hand and field at once for 4 cards. It doesn't matter what you are facing, that's a huge setback because that's 4 cards that prevent your opponent from doing his strategy before you do yours.

Normally having to deal with those shields later might be a problem but that's where Wedding's is awesome because it also has the shield burn to negate that disadvantage (which is the real reason she has shield burn) and Eternal Omega to absolutely ensure you will get there eventually.

You don't need Super Saver because the removal/discard part of the effect usually hits your opponent's ways of fighting back, and since the best way to use Wedding is in mana ramp, your Eternal Omega means she comes back next turn anyway.

If you just want to shield burn there are a whole bunch of other methods which are MUCH faster and easier to use (and "safer" too if you consider giving shields a disadvantage). You really shouldn't be using Wedding only for shield burn in the first place.

quote from waileukwu:

Again, if you want some specific stuff that can punish the user of Wedding, how about these:
1) What, you hate the fact Wedding forces you to put shields? Ghastly drain yourself. you have plenty of cards in hand.
2) What, you can't help the fact that Wedding keep bashing through everything by requiem? Saint Castle + Slaying Ninja can keep her at bay, then discard it immediately the next turn.
3) What, you don't like the fact that a big creature come into play? use this creature:
http://www.tradecardsonline.com/im/selectCard/card_id/173934/cards_lang/1

Remember a creature named Nariel? Wedding hates that. Absolutely hates it. Oh, and there is VPP, of which Wedding hates too. Oh and all those blockers that can nullify attacks...It is a solo creature, very much like Ken Geki and Victory Rush. 1 creature to win you the game, and also 1 creature to loose it for you.

Ok, two things wrong here...

1) Counter cards are nearly NEVER an argument against a card's power because this game is not about "card vs. card", it's about game flow and better positioning.

Bombazar, Sapphire, discard, manaburn and so forth could be countered too (they literally GAVE us cards to do that at the time) but that's not what balance or strategy strength is about.

If you HAVE to use something to just be able to FIGHT a card or strategy (not dominate), that says a lot about how strong it is. But not all other decks and strategies in the game can afford to use some of those methods, and that's where it matters.

2) There are ways to fight Wedding once it is out too but these examples you gave are just bad.

Ghastly Drain doesn't counter anything about Wedding, it just buys you some time. Even if you have it in a deck, you can not afford to have TOO MANY copies because that card is useless against other strategies. And even if you have it you still have to draw it at the right time. And Wedding hits the hand too so its also difficult to hold on to it.

You need to have a deck with ways to take Ghastly and use it whenever it needs to (like mana bonce and spell revival). And then you pay 3 mana, you reduce the damage Wedding does and with those cards you do what...Remove her? Eternal Omega. You can block to buy yourself some time at best, but you can not directly diminish her presence on the field. And then your opponent can play other stuff.

Blocker setups and Ninja Strike, Slayers and what not are also weak because she has AN EFFECT THAT HITS THE FIELD AND HAND, so good luck dodging through that. And if you sacrifice creatures to Slayer and she comes back the next turn you achieved what?

All your examples (and dawriterman's) too involve using MORE CARDS and intricate setups to fight ONE card and give you a TEMPORARY advantage...and Wedding's summoning effect can mess with those too. The odds are not in your favor any way you look at it.

quote from waileukwu:

And then, you talk about Weaknesses/Cons where you said:
'None really. High cost is expected with the effect that Wedding has. It can easily gain speed attacker with the support cards. It can be protected against discard using Berlin, Bell Gravekeeper. It can be reshuffled back to deck if put to grave by slash trio using Forever Princess, An Eternity to Rule Them. So no Apparent Weaknesses.'

and at that, I was speechless...what? Wedding has no weakness? Of course she seems so perfect, 11 cost 13000 power with Eternal Omega and ability to remove creatures into Shields and then remove the Shields through attack. Perfect, isn't it?

No it is not. What you gain by using her is that you will sacrifice your deck composition just so you can use properly. Discard her, and your opponent will cry. Even if you op got it into the BZ, all you need to do is to freeze/stop it from attacking, and she will be one of those giant beatsticks that does nothing. Remember a creature named Nariel? Wedding hates that. Absolutely hates it. Oh, and there is VPP, of which Wedding hates too. Oh and all those blockers that can nullify attacks...It is a solo creature, very much like Ken Geki and Victory Rush. 1 creature to win you the game, and also 1 creature to loose it for you.

Actually I agree with him in the conclusion. He may not have made a convincing case up to that point, but he is right. The card is perfect and it has no drawbacks. It's a bit amusing how you just list all of her advantages and rhetorically go "Perfect isn't it?" as if what you say after necessarily undermines them. You're just contriving a point.

You can argue deck composition about ANY card...The drawback of using any card is that you don't use something else instead, but the problem is how you use what you have.

One does not "sacrifice deck composition" to use Wedding "properly", because Wedding is not just something you add to anything half-assed. The way that sounds is as if you are adding Wedding in a deck that would be better off without it, but that's a logical fallacy from the start.

You build a deck AROUND Wedding because she has ALL the mechanics that allow you to win the game and fight any other strategy at once: power, removal, discard, immortality and counters the natural flow of the game where shields become hand. ALL of them in just ONE card mind you...That actually gives you an insane amount of freedom to the rest of your deck to support that or do other stuff.

A weakness is something that can be exploited with the cards you have or a window of opportunity to take down something big with lesser means. You can find weaknesses in the deck that uses Wedding maybe, but not in the card itself. Once Wedding is out and can be chain replayed you virtually have no way of stopping her. You have to one up her, use something that even surpasses her strength, but that's not a weakness anymore.

The card just has a high cost, but that's fair for what she gives you and the cost is not a flaw of any deck that uses her (because she is not the only card in it). This is not a weakness, this is called being "limited" in the same way that every other card in this game is limited by something, or you wouldn't have a "game" in the first place.

-Nera

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card review Wedding, Zenith of 'Celebration': The real pawner.